Episode 70: Dana Hammer My Best Friend Athena Interview
Rasta
Hello cinnabar moths or any kind of moth you’d like to be welcome to the Writers Triangle, Cinnabar Moth’s podcast about all things publishing and books. Today we are here with Dana hammer, author of My Best Friend Athena. Dana, how’re you doing today?
Rasta
Great. Thank you. How are you?
Rasta
Doing? Good. Thanks for asking. So are you feeling excited about the release of My Best Friend Athena?
Rasta
I’m very excited about it. Yes.
Rasta
Wonderful. And as as you know, perhaps some of our listeners also know My Best Friend Athena is your second book published with us, Does this launch feel different than the launch for Cannibals Guide to Fasting?
Rasta
A little bit? It does, just because the audience is so different. And the subject matter is so different. So? Yeah, the focus has been different than what I’m used to, but in a good way.
Rasta
Okay. So did you have you personally been doing anything different for this launch than you did for the first one?
Rasta
Um, yeah, so with the first book, that’s very much an adult book. So I was going through all of my typical, you know, adult channels, but for this, this is my first children’s or kids book. So I’m kind of having to learn different markets and different ways to reach out to people and reach out to like, teachers and schools, and you know, even just like Mom, friends of mine that have kids. So it’s a different people, but kind of the same tactics.
Rasta
Okay, so you’ve had to, you’ve had to change who you’re reaching out to, but the exact methods are the same.
Rasta
Pretty much.
Rasta
Yeah. How’s that felt for you, with the kind of the change in market and everything has that been comfortable?
Rasta
Um, you know, it has been because I think that it wouldn’t be if it wasn’t for the fact that I am a mom and I have a nine year old daughter. And so it’s sort of more organic to promote a children’s book than it would have been if I didn’t have a kid, you know what I mean, because there’s already kind of a built in, you know, she has the Girl Scouts and groups that I can kind of contact and talk to you about the book. So
Rasta
That is nice. Does seem like you would like to have a much more natural feel into it, because you already have these people that you know, who have kids.
D
Right.
Rasta
And so, with the Cannibals Guide to Fasting being an adult book, and My Best Friend Athena being a children’s book, was the writing process different as well for them.
Rasta
You know, it wasn’t as different as you might think. It’s more just having to kind of edit myself and think, with a more childlike brain, if that makes sense. But the actual process of writing was, like, pretty much the same, I just kind of sit down, I come up with my story, and I bang it out.
Rasta
Okay. And so for you, it’s just changing the language, but otherwise, it’s exactly the same.
D
Pretty much. Yeah.
Rasta
Did you find that, that having to self edit and do those changes was was that difficult at all? Or did you find it pretty straightforward?
Rasta
You know, I think that at one point in my life, I would have found it very difficult. But again, I think motherhood changes that for me, you know, because I’m kind of used to having to edit. There’s a lot of, you know, because I am an adult, and I like horror, and I like violence. And I like those things. But I already spend most of my time editing that stuff away from my kid. So writing a book with that in mind, was a little more natural for me now than it would have been before I had a child.
Rasta
Yeah, that does make sense, as someone who interacts, who’s had to interact with the kids quite a bit for previous work that I’ve done, it does sort of start becoming natural to just stop using certain language around them.
D
Right.
Rasta
And so do you think the, you are able to enjoy the writing process for My Best Friend Athena more, or was it the same?
Rasta
I actually enjoyed this more, in a way specifically because Fanny Fitzpatrick, my protagonist, her headspace is such a fun place to be. She’s such a good person, and she’s funny and She’s witty and she’s smart. And being inside of her head, like really put me in a good headspace. I always felt like I was in a really good mood when I was done writing her and, you know, when I write my darker stuff, that it doesn’t really have that effect, because but, ya know, I would say that writing this middle grade novel has been an extremely fun experience for me.
Rasta
So would you say that the experience has kind of changed how you feel about writing overall, do you think you’ll be writing more middle grade in the future?
Rasta
Um, yeah, I’ve already written the first draft of a sequel to My Best Friend Athena, and I enjoyed that. And I’m thinking, thinking of maybe doing another book is, well, a third one. It’s just, it’s such a fun, light hearted world. And I really like being there, I’m still going to write my adult stuff, my horror stuff, my dark stuff. But I think that this, it’s good to have some range and get as a writer. And I think that it’s good to write some stuff that is good for me psychologically.
Rasta
I do think having some lighter spaces to go to is nice, especially when you’re often delving into some of the harder topics to get into, or darker ones. Since you were mostly in the horror space before, what inspired you to branch out and write a middle grade book, and My Best Friend Athena?
Rasta
Honestly, it was because I, my daughter always wanted to read the things that I wrote. And obviously, that’s not okay. And I thought, you know, what if I wrote something that she could read. And so one week, while my husband took her on vacation at North to visit family, I was like, I have a week to myself, let’s, let’s see if I can write something that’s readable for a young kid. So that was kind of my motivation.
Rasta
It was a lovely motivation. And has your daughter had the opportunity to read any of it yet? Or have you been keeping it secret for now?
Rasta
Not yet, I’ll give her a copy when it’s actually when I can actually give her a hard physical copy. But right now, still on the electric, she doesn’t really have like a reader for that. So yeah.
Rasta
So with the with the process of writing My Best Friend Athena, and with the launch process for it, were there any surprises for you that happened or anything that kind of shocked you about the process?
Rasta
Honestly, no. Things have gone pretty smoothly with this book. So far. Yeah, I wish I had a really interesting answer for that one, but I don’t.
Rasta
I think no surprises can be a good thing, Right? You’ve experienced the book process before you know what you’re getting into. And everything going smoothly is kind of the best thing with this type of stuff, right?
Rasta
That’s how I feel. Yeah.
Rasta
And as you’ve written in the middle grade space, and you’ve expanded from horror and everything, do you feel like that’s improved your confidence as a writer as well?
Rasta
I would say yes, it’s good to know that I have some range. And I’m not just a one trick pony. You know what I mean? It’s because you know, you can get kind of pigeon holed as the, the horror writer, the weird, quirky writer, it’s nice to know that I can do other things as well.
Rasta
Yeah, I can understand that. And I do think there are some people who find success are okay with just being known as the horror writer. But if you’re able to do more than you can reach more people. And that variety feels nice. Like you mentioned before.
Rasta
And out on the one thing,
Rasta
Yeah. So, now that you have a second book coming out, do you feel like you can identify stronger as being an author with like a capital A?
Rasta
Um, I don’t know, I think I felt that way with the first book, to be honest. And I guess I sort of subscribed to the notion that, you know, a writers writer, whether they’re published or not, so under that definition, they feel like I’ve been a writer for a very long time. It’s just now I have like, an actual book deal.
Rasta
Yeah, that makes sense. Because you have been, you have been writing, right. How long have you been writing if you don’t mind me asking?
D
Years, now. I’m not sure exactly. I mean, I’ve always written stuff, but with the aim of publishing it, I’ve been trying to do that for a few years.
Rasta
Okay, so yeah, I had that time when you weren’t really looking to publish. You’re just exploring your creativity.
Rasta
Yeah, yeah. I think like just as a kid, or even as like a young adult, I would just write things for fun. I never intended to publish any of it. It was just something I did.
Rasta
Now that you’ve had a few years where you’ve been searching to publish, you are currently looking at your second book being published, or is your family excited about my best friend Athena launching?
Rasta
I think so. Yeah.
Rasta
Who would you say is the most excited in your family about it?
Rasta
Oh, me? Yeah.
Rasta
That makes sense to me. You’re the person who wrote it right? So yeah. For Making the candles guide to fasting. And my best friend Athena, what are some milestones that the candles kind of fasting achieve that you hope my best friend Athena can achieve and even surpass?
D
Well, I really was pleased with the reviews that my best friend or excuse me, the animals guide to fasting God, I was really pleased that it really seems to resonate with people. It’s been basically all really positive feedback. And I’m hoping that my best friend Athena will play similarly that people will like it. Obviously, if I could make more money off it, that would be a great thing. But yeah, I just hope that people like it really.
Rasta
Okay, so for you, it’s mostly about the connection to your audience.
Rasta
Absolutely.
Rasta
That makes sense. You mentioned before that you’re you’re looking at continuing to write both horror in the horror space and in the middle grade space, with a potential sequel for my best friend, Athena. And how do you feel about switching between the two? Is it is it comfortable having when you do the switch, back and forth?
Rasta
It is and honestly, I think it’s necessary. For me, personally, now, I don’t feel like I could do just one anymore. I really like the transition. I like that I can do something a little dark and a little scary. And I like that when that gets to be too much. I have this other option, I can go back and write something fluffier and kid friendly. I think you know, there’s always going to be humor in both of my genres, or really any genre I write, but I liked it, I can now flip between, like the weightier stuff and the sillier stuff.
Rasta
And so with the having the the sillier stuff, you’re able to kind of take a breather, but still have your creativity being expressed?
Rasta
Yeah, absolutely.
Rasta
The ingredients are a little bit more when it comes to the, the weight of it right? When writing these darker stories, and right, and then switching over to the lighter stories. Is it hard for you to then switch back to the darker stuff? Or is it pretty straightforward? Because you’ve gotten that breather?
Rasta
No, I don’t have any problems switching back and forth. I think I feel like both sorts of stories are a part of me. And it’s easy for me to access them both. Anytime I need to.
Rasta
Okay, that’s mostly just a matter of the mental weight of it. Yeah. That’s interesting to me, because I think that I’ve, personally, when I’ve written some things, I found that there are topics are like, okay, I can get into this for a bit. But then eventually, I just kind of switch my mind off of it. So with the release of the Campbell’s guide to fasting, it created a lot of buzz. Are you aware of the fan base that you’ve created with the book,
Rasta
um, you know, I try not to follow that too terribly much, because I started to stress me out. But I do know that there are people out there who really like it. And that makes me very, very happy.
Rasta
Okay, so the thought of having a fan base kind of is this pressure that you don’t really enjoy, even though you’re happy that people are connecting to,
Rasta
I love the idea of having a fan base, but like, I don’t necessarily want to focus on it a lot. If that makes any sense.
Rasta
It does. It’s, it’s it’s great that people are connecting to love the people are reading it. But also, that’s not something that you can spend a lot of time thinking about because it can kind of distract you from just writing get the authentic creativity from your mind a bit, right? Absolutely. And
Rasta
I don’t want it to like overly influenced me, you know what I mean? Yeah. And so
Rasta
with wind and going into my best friend Athena, are you excited for a specific character to be interacted with by by your audience? And by people reading it? Is there a straight character you think? Oh, yeah, I can’t wait for people to experience like for example, the main character, Fanny Fitzpatrick.
Rasta
I like to think that all three of the main characters that I’ve written are really cool and then people will like them. Personally. Gemma is kind of my favorite right now. Because she is she’s got like this kind of little dark psychopathic Street to her that I think is hilarious and really fun to have and like a little Girl. But I think that all of the characters are really strong. And I think that, you know, I hope that kids this age range will find things to admire about them and connect to with them.
Rasta
So each of them have their own personality traits that you’re hoping that people connect, connect to and and find enjoyable,
D
Right.
Rasta
You mentioned before that the inspiration for it was having was your was your daughter and having a book that she could read? Right? Are there were there any characters that you had in mind for your daughter to connect to on a personal level, be like, I think that my daughter would love this character.
D
Um, I really, I think that she’ll love Athena. I really wanted her to connect with Fanny. Like my daughter Fanny is really good at math. Fanny’s very confident, in a lot of ways. She has a good attitude about things for the most part. I mean, she’s, she’s flawed, she’s not perfect, but she’s a genuinely good person, and she tries to do the right thing. And she’s very motivated, and goal oriented. And I think that those are all good qualities that I would like my daughter, really everyone’s daughter to look up to.
Rasta
Okay, so you have a, you have a couple of characters with qualities that you want to represent as sort of a positive model and also, just for them to connect to and enjoy. Right? And then for you, you mentioned that Gemma’s, your favorite character and my best friend Athena, is that correct? He is. And with that, and having written the book, are there any easter eggs or surprises for fans to potentially look out for?
D
I don’t know that there are easter eggs, but there’s definitely surprises. I don’t want to give them away. But there are there are twists and turns that I think will be nice surprises for people who are reading it. Yeah.
Rasta
Is there anything that you think the the potential readers might, will love the most about? My best friend, you know, are any standout archetypes or dynamics.
D
Um, I think the like the reveal, at the end, I think the like the twist, where we find out some new information. I think that they’ll like the humor in it, I think the like, because there are a lot of really funny spot spots. And I think that I hope that they’ll like being in Fanny’s head as much as I liked being in her head.
Rasta
And know when I, when I’ve read it, I enjoyed various perspective on things it was, it was kind of is sweet and cute.
D
Yeah, it is.
Rasta
So with writing My Best Friend Athena, you mentioned your daughter is the inspiration but did you think a lot about your daughter while writing it? Did you think about the fans while writing it, What was your focus when you start thinking about the story.
D
Um, I was thinking about all of those things, actually. And then also thinking of myself, when I was that age, I tried really hard to remember what it felt like to be 11. And I really wanted it to seem authentic. I know sometimes when you read things, written by adults, that are about young children, a lot of times just like my parents homework, my parents homework, my parents homework, but you know, when I remember when I was 11, I rarely thought about those things. So I wanted it to be relatable to like real children and have have family care about things that an actual 11 year old might care about. I don’t know if I 100% succeeded in that. But that was my goal. So I tried to channel you know, kids I know who are about that age, while also trying to remember what it was like to be that age myself.
Rasta
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Because I do agree with you that quite often these books end up with children that seem almost businesslike in their behavior. Where where we’re school is a form of work, and that they interact that on that level, which doesn’t really feel genuine to a child’s experience. Right?
D
Right. A lot of these kids in these middle grade books, it’s like all they think about his school and I’m like, I don’t think that’s accurate. I mean, maybe some maybe for some kids, but that certainly wasn’t my experience.
Rasta
Yeah, I think for mine, I spent some time thinking about school, but most of my school thoughts are mostly about my friends at school. Yeah, teachers that I liked at school.
D
Yeah, it’s more about the social stuff that you think of like, I don’t know, at least that was how it was for me.
Rasta
Yeah, I definitely agree. Thinking back over, I had a lot more social mindset. Of course, homework was part of it. And it was part of my thoughts, but much less so than hanging out with my friends on the weekend or, you know, right. The after school activities, sports, all of that, right. Yeah. I hadn’t thought of that. But now that you mentioned it, there’s something over some books that I’ve read in the past that are very much that way with, with children being represented as sort of in a kind of sterile environment of sorts. Yes. And I do think having read my poster, I think you do personally, I think you do a great job with bringing more life to that and bringing more of a I guess, seeing it as someone who’s no longer kid authentic view, might not be fair, I might be a little bit biased. I don’t know.
D
You know, the same here. That’s what I hope I really hope that it does come across as authentic. I hope that kids who read it feel like it’s at least somewhat representative of how their their lives are. I mean, fantasy stuff aside, obviously.
Rasta
Oh, yeah, it is a fantasy book at the same time. But as you think that those, that slice of life portion of it is still there. And so with my best friend, Athena, and that writing process of getting into, did you ask any questions of your daughter? Or like, reach out to other people for feedback about that type of thing? Or did you mostly do that from your own thoughts?
D
Um, it’s mostly just observing kids interact with each other, and also just remembering my own fifth grade experience. So no, I didn’t really like research it in any serious way.
Rasta
Still, I think even I think that with your memories, and everything that you’ve used, that it’s comes across very well, from my personal opinion.
D
Thank you.
Rasta
And so yeah, I’m excited for the release of my best friend Athena. And I’m confident that your fans are as well. Do you have any final thoughts or things that you want to say about my best friend Athena or things that you’re hoping people look out for with it?
D
I’m just the it is coming out in February. And I hope that everybody likes it. And any, if you have any, you know, comments or questions, you can always reach out to me on my website, or whatever. And I’m happy to talk with anybody.
Rasta
Wonderful. Thank you, Dana, for talking with us today and being on the writers triangle. And thank you to all of our beautiful models for listening. Be sure to buy My Best Friend Athena is coming out. Excuse me, sorry. But My Best Friend Athena is coming out on Friday, the seventh and 2023. And, Dana, can you tell us really quickly where to find you? You mentioned a website?
D
Yeah, my website is www Dana hammer.com. Or you can reach me on my facebook author page, Dana Hammer author.
Rasta
Wonderful. And for all of our listeners, be sure to visit cinnabar moth.com to check out the transcripts and we’ll also have the link to Dana social media. Dana, once again, thank you for coming on. It was a pleasure talking with you. Thanks for having me. Bye bye.