Episode 85: Ira Geneve Interview

Rasta
Hello cinnabar moths or any kind of moth you’d like to be welcome to the writers triangle, Cinnabar Moth;s podcast about all things publishing and books. Today we’re here with Ira Geneve, our very talented book cover artist. How’re you doing today?

I
Hello, everything good. Thank you, everybody pleased to be here. And I’m very nervous.

Rasta
It’s wonderful to have you on. And I’m looking forward to be able to talk with you for the rest of this interview.

I
Thank you. Thank you for the invitation.

Rasta
It’s wonderful having you on thank you for accepting. So I want to jump right into it. How did you decide to be an artist in general?

I
Oh, it’s a long story. Like a lot of artists before me. I’ve been joined as a hobby since I was a child. But only recently, recently, like two years ago, I decided to actually make it a career. And this year, I’m going full time.

Rasta
Oh, congratulations. Thank you. And so or has been something that’s been in your entire life that you’ve decided that’s kind of been since childhood passion of yours?

I
Yes, yes, I’ve been drawing on paper initially. I think I was like six. And then I started to draw digitally just to create my characters with some friends of mine. And that just evolved until today when I’m trying to do stretches for other people.

Rasta
Sounds like an awesome progression from a passion to something that’s developing into a full time career path for you.

I
Yeah, it really is. And I’m very grateful that I get to do what I like, and also live of it because it’s an important part.

Rasta
Yeah, yeah. And so you have being an artist in general. And then there’s also book cover art. How did you decide to become a book cover artist?

I
That’s actually a very funny story. Because I didn’t decide myself, one of my brother’s clients, I’ve drawn for them for a book of that. And then they said, Hey, I’m working with this publishing company. Would you like me to enter this? And that’s how it started. I took the opportunity. It was a challenge at first, but I’m glad I did.

Rasta
Okay, so it actually started from just doing it for one person and that introduction leading into going into book cover art as a whole.

I
Yeah, yeah.

Rasta
And you mentioned that you’ve done paper, are as part are are on paper, as well as digital art. What other types of art do you do professionally?

I
Right now, I don’t draw on paper anymore. That was just when I was little. Professionally, I do mostly digital art, illustrations. Different styles, I am quite versatile, and I can adapt to everything that the clients desire. So I’m trying to challenge myself every time I draw something. I don’t know how to get categorized.

Rasta
Okay, yeah, I guess, if you’re doing a bunch of different styles for people, it can be kind of hard to pin it down to a type of art, right?

I
Yeah. Yeah. Mostly, I like to draw storytelling stuff like illustrations. Like I mentioned, I can draw also in the animal style. A bit. Yeah. I don’t have miniature animals, if that’s something that you’d be interested in. Okay,

Rasta
so yours is more landscapes and characters? Characters, mostly? Yeah. Okay. Now it would for this the artistic process, would you say that your process for a book covers is different than the other types of art that you create?

I
I will say yes, mostly because in the book cover, I don’t control the process. When I dropped myself or for other clients, I have a bit more control over how things are going. But when I’m trying a book cover, I have to wait for feedback and to adapt everything for the feedback. It’s, I would say a bit longer, but that’s a bit more difficult because we the bulk of it, when you draft for people’s lifetime work, because some people just put their own life in the stories they want the writing. I have to kind of get in the mindset, like what do they actually want to see from this book cover? What do they actually want to feel when they look at this book over with a private Commission, which is sometimes just the character, it’s a bit easier because I have the references I just joined.

Rasta
So there’s fewer references to work with when it comes to book covers, and there’s a lot more any artistic take that has to be in creativity or has to be applied to somebody else’s ideas of what it should be.

I
Exactly. Yeah. And that’s quite difficult because on one hand, I have artistic freedom. But on the other hand, I don’t, it’s difficult.

Rasta
I can imagine that’s kind of a hard push and pull.

I
Yeah, yeah. But the people from snap, I think, an amazing job to make everything smooth and easy as possible.

Rasta
I’m glad that you’ve been enjoying working with us. And Powerball would you say that the process for coming a cover artist from just being an artist for illustrations and such, we say that transition was difficult for you?

I
It was a bit difficult because it kind of changed everything I was doing before. When I’m trying for the perfect clients, for myself. They kind of know what the ones I have to know what they want. So I don’t really need to do many thumbnails, mid explorations, just basic stuff. But if a book cover some authors, they know what they want, but they really don’t. So there’s lots of, yeah, there’s lots of exploitation that has to be done first. And that’s the part that I actually struggled a bit with in the beginning. But now I kind of get used to it.

Rasta
Okay, so the, the kind of contrast between someone having an idea of okay, if my character looks like this for an illustration versus I have this idea for a cover that, and it’s not as specific, but it is still a very clear picture in their heads, they have to try and articulate to you. There’s always a little bit that’s lost in translation.

I
Yes, yes. It’s awesome. Like, I don’t know how to explain this verb, something mean, but sometimes, some authors have particular things that they want on the covers that I as an artist don’t really see them to meet together. So there’s also the struggle to make things still look good, while still keeping everything that the author wants. And it’s not a fault, because you want your book to represent your entire story. So there are a lot of elements that you want to be there, but sometimes not all of them work.

Rasta
Yeah, I think a book, you know, has this full rich story that they want to encapsulate, but every piece can be difficult to put into a single image, right? Yeah, yeah. Now with the process of creating book covers, and going through it and experiencing, what would you say has been the most surprising thing about that creative process?

I
The most surprising thing sounds a bit weird. But it was the diversity of the books I’m drawing for. Now, I should have thought about it. But for some reason I didn’t. But now every time I’m getting a new book, a new contract, I’m so excited to see what is what it is about, and what, what I helped bring up life, because in the end, that’s what it’s about.

Rasta
Yeah, the process of bringing up a lot of different genres and different styles.

I
Yeah, and a lot of different people because you can see from the descriptions, and the backdrops and etc. You can see the personality of the artists and I think that’s quite interesting. Every book is not only different by jelly, or Jenga, I don’t know how to pronounce that. But also, I don’t know they have their personality. It’s, it’s pretty interesting to me.

Rasta
So you’ve done quite a few diverse covers, for example, the playfulness of the middle grade cover for the secret benefits of invisibility, versus the more minimalist approach to the cover of the next witness. And then the emotional depth the scene in the cover for the secrets that kill us. Just to listen books from cinnabar moth. How did you master all these different diverse styles?

I
Oh, I can’t say mastered them. Because like I said, it’s they’re so different with between themselves. For example, right now, I won’t say the name, but I’m working on another Middle Grades book. And it’s totally different than what you would expect from the secrets, secret benefits of invisibility. Every book, I think I’m trying to treat it as its own thing. As for the styles, I don’t know, I just, I just try to do my best with every one of them. And the feedback from snuba and also the authors it’s always super valuable because for you Somebody mentioned the next weakness. Initially, I had a completely different vision about it. I was doing a scene with a lot of people with the main character middle. But then the author said, Now I would like something more like this. And then in the end, I liked that idea a lot more than mine. So it’s just like winging it.

Rasta
So it’s sort of a collaborative process for you. Yes, yes. Okay. And so with making book covers, and having those be out there and represent these books, there’s also cases where there, it leads to it being seen around the world, for example, seen on billboards featured in press releases, and magazines be in bookstores globally. How does it feel to know that your art something that you’ve created is being seen in all these places around the world?

I
It’s amazing. Because you wouldn’t think I’d say, because you actually have thoughts like, I’m trying to converse. It’s normal to see them physically. But it’s not normal until you do see it in physical form. I think a few weeks ago, I’ve seen the one of the books I’ve jofa. I’ve seen it in physical form for a person that bought it and reviewed it. And I had such an amazing feeling because hey, that is my in some must hint. Just imagining that it’s on featured press releases and magazines and etc. It’s just it’s

Rasta
Yeah, mostly the same thing when you’re going into it you’re aware of, but you don’t necessarily connect with it. Right? It’s like, yeah, thinking about it. Of course, they’re going to be everywhere that the books are but in what you’re doing is just making this one cover.

I
Yeah, yeah.

Rasta
So when you when you go through this process, and you finish a cover, do you do anything to celebrate?

I
If you’re thinking like parties and stuff like that, no. But with every book, I feel like I grow a bit more, I learned a bit more. So every time I’m just showing it to my friends, like, Hey, I finished this. Look how cool it looks. But, yeah, I guess you can say that’s a celebration itself.

Rasta
Okay, so you do share your work and your excitement with your friends and the people around you.

I
Just in closed spaces. I know, I can’t show it online until it’s a field, which is amazing. But, yeah.

Rasta
And so with that, and it’s I imagine you have this excitement when you finish. But do you also feel that excitement again? With the cover reveals that happen?

I
Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Because Absolutely, they expect this when I was waiting for the first book reveal, I feel John for it was such a I find difficult to explain, because it was such a surprise. I connected with the person that that the altar. And then they wrote me and thanked me and everybody was busy in the book too. And then I learned more about the author, like one on one because in the process, I don’t really connect with them one on one personally. And now every time there’s a book reveal, I wait for it because I get to meet the author in a way. It’s really fun.

Rasta
Sunday night, you’re able to connect with all these authors that you’ve done some work with, but don’t necessarily connect with until that reveal fully happens. And then you have the opportunity to be more open with and communicate with them.

I
Yeah, I still have authors that tag me in the posts are still thank me for the books. It’s just, it’s really nice.

Rasta
So what does your family and what do your friends think about your job as a book cover artist, it’s a bit of an unconventional career choice.

I
It is my family for example, it’s a bit more of it that is not going to be consistent enough for me to live off. That’s why I actually opened Patreon lately. And I’m trying my best I think it’s going to be alright. My My father was I actually don’t know. Did you really comment on them but I do get some likes on it. And my friends are very supportive that if it was for my friends and my partner, I wouldn’t be where I am today because they kind of gave me the posh to go full time. like to grab the dream. And yeah, I’m very painful for them.

Rasta
So your partner and your friends have been there to give you the confidence to continue striving for this dream that you’ve had your entire life? Yes, yes. And stigma for maybe a little bit different than what you expected, but it’s still something that they support you in and that you’ve been able to find excitement and have a good time.

I
Yes, yes. It’s not that different if you think about it, because my initial dream was to draw for games, like Magic, The Gathering, like League of Legends, etc. So, sorry?

Rasta
Sorry, go ahead. I was saying, okay.

I
And I’m still bringing characters and stories and stuff like that to life. So it’s not that difference. It is, but it’s not.

Rasta
So it’s, that is a very similar thing, I guess. Because you’re still producing for a larger form of media than just the art itself. Right.

I
Yeah. Yeah.

Rasta
So do you think that book covers and book cover art is respected as art in the art world?

I
I would say yes, if you know how it I think it’s a bit of a misnomer. conception that only big franchises like the Song of Ice and Fire like Harry Potter, Exeter, they get to have this hand strong, personalized. book covers, while other stories that are not that known, just get some edited a bit low quality thinks it’s a bit mean to say it, but I think a lot of people think like that. But once you’re you are in this industry industry. You know, it’s not the case. It’s like, if you add them there, you know, is that the case and it’s respected? And we’re job. But if you’re not in this is like, a book cover? What? What’s so special about it?

Rasta
So it’s kind of a lack of transparency in the industry, makes people assume, Oh, it’s just something that somebody took like a pre made images, stock footage, stock image, did a little bit of editing, and it’s done.

I
Yes, I think it’s actually because people think, oh, is your self publishing? What are you writing something like on Wattpad? No, no shame to work with people. There are some amazing stories in there. But a lot of people just think it’s less professional, quote, unquote.

Rasta
Yeah, I do think there’s a lot of misconceptions with a lot of things in publishing, actually, not just book covers. I think interviews like these, where we have these conversations can help people who don’t know, learn a little bit more about the process.

I
Yeah, yeah. That’d be amazing.

Rasta
So for your art and your your career, do you want book cover creation to be the main type of art that you create? Or are you hoping to be able to expand into other industries? I know you mentioned video game or earlier.

I
If you ask me this, at the beginning of my journey with cinnabar moth, I would say, I wouldn’t want it to be my main thing. But right now, I think I thought I was in mind if it is.

Rasta
Is what do you think caused that change from your initial thought of, to now being more confident saying yes, I do.

I
Um, I think the consistency I have, like consistent work I have with cinnabar moth. And I actually don’t know, like, I can point pinpoint, it’s right. This made me change my mind. But thinking right now, once I be able, or will they want another job to work for game gaming company? I don’t know. I don’t think so. Because right now, I have work to do. But I simply didn’t have time for my own things, my own art and followers next day. So I think right now it’s, it’s, I’m pretty, I’m pretty good, though it is.

Rasta
So you’re enjoying kind of the balance that you have currently with the amount of work that you have, as well as the amount of freedom that you have? Yes, yes. I think that’s a really good thing. I think a lot of people often struggle with finding that kind of work balance versus private balance.

I
Yeah, I think it’s it especially for artists. It’s such a big struggle. Because if you don’t do something you feel like you’re unproductive. So you feel guilty. But if you skip doing things you just burn out, and you just end up doing nothing. So it’s Yeah.

Rasta
I think I think that is a key thing to keep in mind. Yeah. And so I want to follow up on with book cover creation, and with books that are, you know, that would have the covers that you’ve drawn and the work that you’ve done for them. If a book with your cover on it, were to become a best seller, would that be exciting for you?

I
Oh, okay. You can you imagine? Yes. Yes, it will be. But you mentioned my country, it’s a bit – I’m from Romania. And in my country, it’s a bit difficult to find books unless they are bestsellers. So imagine it coming into my country and friends or family and having it in the hands and be like, Oh, look at this cover. It’s so cool. Yeah, it’s by me.

Rasta
Yeah, that’s I imagine that’d feel amazing even to have that be something you could talk about. With your family and friends, but also to know just for yourself. I did that.

I
Yeah. Yeah.

Rasta
So if you had a cover that was on a best seller, do you think you’d want to celebrate in that in some way?

I
Oh, yeah. I think that one will be celebrated. Think well, worth celebrating. Yeah.

Rasta
So we have cinnabar. Moth, we are very lucky to have your our on our covers, we appreciate the work that you’ve done. It’s very beautiful, and well done. And we do nominate the covers for awards. If you were to get an award for the work that you’ve done with these book covers, would you want to travel to award events?

I
Oh, there’s so many circumstances or questions in the middle. But in big words, yes. I would love to.

Rasta
So if you were to go to an award event, do you have someone that you think you would take with you?

I
Oh, probably my partner.

Rasta
That makes sense. Your partner’s the person closest to you. And so this is, of course, assuming that it was possible, right? I mean, currently with the way the world’s going with COVID and everything, as well, just potential financials, insights that may be difficult. But everything worked was in place. That’d be something that you’d be excited to do. Yes, yes. Now, if thinking about the awards that are possible, do you have any awards in mind that, if possible, you’d like to win this specific art award?

I
Um, I don’t think they do what I do, if, like any word like that, or a word like that in mind, so I didn’t really think about it. This is more like, big or small. If I win, it’s, it’s a win.

Rasta
So for you just having the recognition of being like, hey, people thought my art was awesome enough to get an award is enough for you.

I
Yes, exactly.

Rasta
I think that’s a great mindset to have of just being like, I’m doing my art, and I’m putting it out there. And if people like it, that’s what’s important.

I
Yeah, that’s what I’m trying to follow. Of course, that the doubts and moments Well, no, but yeah, like you’re going forward.

Rasta
And so with the idea of your, the covers that you’ve produced, being on bestsellers, and, you know, circulating the world, really, there’s this potential aspect to becoming famous and very well known, right? Yeah. Do you have an I do? Would you like to be famous enough that people recognize you on the street? Or do you think you’d enjoy your privacy more?

I
Um, as you can see, I don’t really use my real name. Ira Geneve is my artist name. I do try to keep a bit of a separation between the two. Because sometimes, I’m lucky enough that my followers at the moment don’t do that. But I’m also still small. But sometimes a lot of people forget that behind an artist is a real person. So I’m trying to keep my private life private As much as possible, I’m not that much of a private person. As you can see, I’m very talkative. So, sometimes I will just say things or just show things. But I do want to have a bit of separation. And to answer your question. I think I will like my artist personal not to be famous, famous, but me to be. That makes sense.

Rasta
Yeah, it does. You have your alias and who you are as as Irish. And you’d like that to become well known as your art and your work to be well known. But you’d still like to have, you know, your private life be private.

I
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Rasta
And that’s awesome. And I think the, with the work that you’ve been doing, but it’d be amazing if you got the recognition for the beauty of the covers that you’ve created for us. And I’m looking forward to seeing more of your work as it comes out and to working with you more in the future as well.

I
Thank you, same here. Same here.

Rasta
I’d like to thank you, Ira for talking with me today and for being on the writers triangle. And thank you to all of our beautiful moths for listening. Ira, can you tell us where we can find you for social media?

I
Yes, you can find me mainly on Twitter. That’s what I post most. I just have a Instagram account, a tumblr account. You can also find me on Patreon if you’d like to support me.

Rasta
Could you let the listeners know what your Twitter is?

Ira Geneve just like my name.

Rasta
Okay. And for all everybody listening, be sure to visit cinnabar moth.com where you can check out the transcripts and we’ll also have the link to Ira’s social media. I write once again, thank you for coming on today. It’s been a pleasure talking with you.

I
It was a pleasure for me too. Thank you for having me and I hope we can do this again in the future.

Rasta
Yeah, bye bye.

I
Bye bye.